Ouch rough call

It seems that a fellow blogger has brought to light a issue with Real Money Trading (RMT) and apparently an Alliance Leader Gilgamesh1980 whom has become a ‘secondary’ victim. I applaud CCP’s continuing efforts to eradicate this but even to me and the “hang them high” attitude this seems a bit harsh.

I will copy what Mail Lite wrote here:

A few weeks ago Gilgamesh1980 and his other 2 accounts got banned for 14 days for breaking the EULA. When he first started the game he had a RL friend who asked him to put up some hard earned ISK to go towards a POS network in exchange for monthly/quartkey payouts down the line.

He missioned, saved and bought a few GTC’s to donate to this friend in return for a stable revenue to help him in his EvE career. So far so good. It lasted a 3 year period.

Then one day a few weeks ago he got a message from GM Nova. His accounts had been banned as his ‘friend’ had been selling and buying ISK for real money out of game. He had also been selling high end items for real life money.

Now admittedly I know very little about how all this works. I loathe, hate, and find it disgusting that people will go to great lengths to cheat.  The “cheat” I mean is buying/selling ISK for cash.  Flat out I cannot stand cheating in almost any form, play within the rules dammit. Admittedly, the rules can be tough to pin down and seem to change at times.

The issue is that it seems as if innocent people can get dragged down into this.

I tend to pass people small amounts of money where I can so this bother s me to some degree.

I also ( as a Director within CEPTA) routinely pass out modules/ ships and whatnot for our members sometimes setting up contracts.

Lastly I buy ships from people I do not know.  When part of a large alliance how on earth can you possibly know everyone that may buy or sell some object?  You cannot.  Which is troubling given the little info we have on Gilamesh1980.  I encourage you to read Mail Lite’s blog  “The beginnings of Piracy” http://thebeginningsofpiracy.blogspot.com/2010/06/alliance-leader-down.html for  abit more background.  Hopefully like he suggests someone can ask CCP to look into this again.

~ by Manasiv5 on June 23, 2010.

12 Responses to “Ouch rough call”

  1. I worked for a disco and club design and installations company for ten years. The boss was a long time friend from my school days and the business was doing well. I came to work on a monday morning one day after a long long weekend where we busted our humps getting a contract in well under schedule, to find the recievers and police on the company property.

    Seems that my long time friend was not on holiday but had absconded with the cash…over three million of it, and none of our suppliers had been paid for months. I knew nothing about it even though I knew him, as I thought, well. Association is not proof of wrongdoing. Unless there is eveidence to the contrary then a ban seems draconian.

    My friend has been in the wind for over fifteen years now. He got away with it and eleven other emplyees and I lost our jobs, my electrical tools, test gear and company car,,, I miss that car.

  2. I have known Gilgamesh1980 for quite some time, and have heard him mention the investments that are involved and doubt that he had any knowledge at all of it being RMT's. I have seen some of the comments saying that he must of known, but I also know people who have been married for 20 years and had no knowledge of their partners cheating on them.

    The action in this case seemed to be very arbitary, and I wouldnt be suprised due to the circumstances that there may not have been some colussion with alliances at the time due to the circumstances at the time.

    The way that some GM's answer or deal with petitions already makes me doubt their actions, as they dont actually seem to deal honestly with them when they are given facts that they can check. The abilty of some to actually confer with people who have more knowledge of the game (inside CCP) than themselves seems to have suffered as well.

    To me you should be able to trust GM's to make the right choice, but lately it seems that I dont hear anyone playing eve repeating how fantastic the GM's are when they are dealing with them.

    The circumstances that have taken Gilgamesh out of the game has left a pretty foul taste in the mouths of most who know him, and that number would over 100.

    • Add me to that list Odesssima, I wish I knew everything to be able to fairly say to CCP good job or WTF were you thinking. Alas I do not nor will I. For the sake of your Alliance I hope he is reinstated to at least have a decant transfer of power…

  3. From what I read about the incident, I think the main problem is that he received regular payements back from his friend who was doing the scamming, connecting him en his wallet several times to the dirty transactions.

    • I hear you and I think that this too is the reason, however, having been scammed myself, what protection is given to the buyer

  4. "saved and bought a few GTC’s to donate to this friend"

    When a GTC is sold for ISK on the forum, The buyer must have the ISK in the player wallet, and the time is automatically applied to the account and cant be converted into Plex’s or re-sold for ISK.

    He may have transfered ISK to his RL friend who later sold it for RMT.

  5. If they start banning for trading with a player that traded ingame for outgame money they could as well start banning everyone since the chance is likely we all bought something once from such a person.

    On another note its nearly 24 hous since this move of TQ started and still it is offline

  6. I read this earlier and felt that it's clearly an injustice that a third party would suffer such extreme measures because of his receiving of ill gotten gains. After thinking about it a little more I was still a bit upset but I did find it unusual that someone would still be getting a stipend from a years old investment that was never really that much to begin with. So I am now *assuming* that there was at least the inner knowledge that this guy was cheating because he had so much ISK to throw around.

    But this is one of those issues where I don't know how to feel because I have no clue about the whole truth and am wary of trusting the account of someone who has everything to lose.

  7. CCP has extraordinarily strong incentives not to falsely ban someone. When CCP bans someone they quite literally are losing money by lost subs, and they face the fallout/wrath of people like the OP here who believe their friend's pleas of innocence.

    The odds are very, very high that your friend Gilgamesh1980 was far more involved than you have been led to believe. CCP has no incentive, none, to ban people without justification, and very, very good reasons not to do so.

    • My friend? I don't know him and probably never will. I can only comment on the info I DO know which is the guy was banned for something that even I have done ( buying a ship from someone I did not know might be an isk seller) Screw that! I buy shit all the time I don't check who sells it or even if they are legit, nor should I.

  8. The interesting thing is this is not "someone I met in game and was partnered with unknowing" it was someone admitting that the offender in question was a RL friend. All the talk about trading with someone in game, buying and selling ships, contracts and the rest is basically people assuming that CCP's action is an arbitrary one that could involve any player in eve when at least two pertinent facts stick out to me in all the information public suggest that CCP's actions may be justified… 1. They are RL friends … so a simple association in game only is not the only factor, 2. The relationship in game is specified as being in operation for over 3 years (This RL friend has been an ISK seller going back that far and you never asked questions? — You are an "Internet Security Expert" right?)

    It is entirely possible that you get involved through random association with someone doing something to break a EULA. You may get punished for actions that you might have been involved with only marginally … But 3 years? a RL friend? … If this had been a nobody player instead of an alliance leader for a fairly well know pirate corp with bloggers for friends would anybody be giving that person the benefit of the doubt?

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