Sometimes the Windshield, sometimes the bug

So it seemed that over the last few days we have gotten in some big fights with our nemesis SE/C0ven.  Assisting the DT/ Initiative and Co2 we have been well helping them out a bit.

Neither of the two  fights proved to be especially good for SYS-K, but hell that’s why we live where we do, if you only engage and think you’ll win every fight…think again.

I understand now why some many NC pilots complained out loud about the issues dealing with system performance.  Having fought in some huge battles I thought we had a lock on how to deal with it and were well equipped in dealing with system lag.  System lag ( at least in the last two fights was absolutely horrendous.  Granted it does seem to affect both Aggressor and Defender BUT he who loads the grid first seems to have a upper hand to say the least.

The first fight i escaped unscathed, the second my and my beloved guardian ( survivor of 25 fleets) died in a pretty ball of color. Repping during a  huge fleet was well an exercise in patience.  The engagement lasted well on 35 minutes or so, so keeping my wits about me was a key to surviving but the ability to actually rep people was hampered by my inability to even see if my rep cycles were applying themselves.  I was the one who setup the cap chains and kept the logi’s organized and we stood our ground for a excellent amount of time.  IN the end though there were only so many of us and even manually deactivating the reppers and putting them on other targets just did not work.

Nope I was not jammed.  We just could not tell that our reps were doing anything.  Our target callers were kept alive for a good long while, which shows SOME of our reps got through but even with all effects off, Overview in lag mode ( yes I have an overview for lag), and no brackets on we still could not tell if rep cycles were landing.

So we were the bug indeed. Such is the way it goes at times. Learn to live with it, and fight again.

Along those lines we touch upon a topic most seem to grasp but not comprehend.


Skill points and the ships that pilots fly.

brand spanking New pilot ( NOT COUNTING THE BONUS TIME)

It takes 34days to get into a interceptor with good learning skills less time(26 days)

It takes 93 days to get into a Battlecruiser (harbinger in this case) which is cut to 55 days with good learning skills

It takes 200 days to get into a properly fitted T2 zealot but only 111 with decent learning skills

lastly it takes 222 Days to get into a T2 fitted Battleship(apoc in this case)  and this can be cut to 122 days with good learning.

Remember within these plans …WEAPONS SYSTEM BEFORE anything else.

So a Good combined training que ( that would combine ALL these together)  would be:

  1. Interceptors
  2. Battlecruisers
  3. Heavy Assault/Recon
  4. Battleships

An alternate plan would be to have a second toon  (slower to start faster to completion)

  1. basic learning skills to 5
  2. Advanced learning skills to 4
  3. Interceptors
  4. Battlecruisers
  5. HAC/Recons
  6. Battleships

this progression teaches you basic skills of tackling then of firepower then advanced T2 HAC’s then battleships.

Stepping into a BS when you ahve 5 M SP is not the way to do it.  Right skill points for the right job. Learn what each class can teach you then moved forward.  it can be a very linear progression but once you KNOW the tactics and skills you can always fall BACK to that class.  I can field 5 interceptors for the cost of 1 Abbadon Battleship.  That is 5 tacklers for 1 DPS machine.  I can also field 3-4 Battlecruisers for the  same cost as the Abbadon.  Now if 5 Abbadon pilots ship down to a tackler that is a problem in the opposite direction.

Would it put down the same DPS a fully skilled zealot pilot?  No,  would you be useful to the fleet, definitely yes.  I have yet to see a fleet in  which tacklers were not wanted.


if your at 5M SP stay in your ceptor, if your at 10M SP get in your BC, if your at 15M SP get in your HAC/ BS

TC all and good hunting.

~ by Manasiv5 on November 1, 2010.

6 Responses to “Sometimes the Windshield, sometimes the bug”

  1. The problem for a new player with the "wait until your skills are up there" is that for most of them this means being left out of even drake fleets let alone the hac gangs. Further, the difference without all the supporting skills for a new character in a BS and a new character in a Inty is enormous for ratting, which is actually what a majority of those new characters are going to do to actually afford anything. If I were starting eve from scratch I would not do the supporting skills — I'd go straight to a drake, then supporting skills, and then backfill to frigate 5 and start mastering some ships…. all the pvp skill training plans in the world do little good to a new pilot that can't run plexs for the isk to get started. Many of us established pilots (I up around 35mil SP now) forget what it really was like at the 5 mil mark, the endless learning skills, the not having any isk to give yourself a margin of ships. New pilots want to fly the big ships because outside of pvp ops that's their ticket to a stronger wallet.

  2. I was involved in the LXQ NC fight, came in late when the numbers were high, actions were taking twenty minutes or more. After an hour or so and I was able to do almost nothing gave up and eventually left for home.

    I love that these huge fights are possible, they're certainly better than before, but obviously some work still needs to be done.

    Re: getting into a ship. I have seen far too many new pilots chomping at the bit to fly a Battleship or similar and not have the supporting skills. Some listen to the advice of wait and get your skills up, some don't, those are the ones that lose their shiny new ship and I'm sure a percentage of them give up Eve in disgust.

    Were they right for Eve? Probably not, but some of them may have come around if they'd listened to the more experienced member of their corp and/or alliance.

  3. Erm… just to be picky… "lastly it takes 22 Days to get into a T2 fitted Battleship(apoc in this case) and this can be cut to 122 days with good learning."

    I'm interested in what the 22 days was supposed to be 😀
    I am dreadfully guilty of rushing to get into a ship that I should have waited – "But its soooo shiney!"
    I lost a fleet of BC's 1 after another on a level 3 mission. As cozmik said.. "it’s called Human Nature."

    Whilst it can be devestating for the pilot… its great for us ship builders!!!

  4. Darn, sorry I missed the chance to fly with you guys over the weekend. Hopefully we'll have some more chances in the near future.

    I totally agree with the skill/ship ratio you mention, it is the rule of thumb. Tough when you are hungry to help, but us vets need to make sure we're doing a good job of passing this along to the next generation.

  5. I couldn't support this post more. Everytime I see a relative noob lose a big ship I keep wondering if there's not something missing in the tutorials to tell new players the Number One Rule in EVE. That rule is usually carried through word of mouth, but New Eden is a dangerous place enough as it is, maybe that rule needs to be hammered in a bit harder right from the start. Anyway, there will always be players who will fly ships they shouldn't be flying; it's called Human Nature.

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